When Protti and Gein are being interviewed, the voice that asks the questions is clearly in a different space from the room in which they're confessing. That reminds me of your experimentation with on- and off-screen sound in the earlier films.
I wanted a detached, off-screen voice because I wanted to focus on the confession itself. I like the separation you mention, but mainly it's a way of having the confessions seem like monologues rather than dialogues, even though the original texts I quote are questions and answers.
Also, in the shots of Orinda, even when it's clear that the sounds that accompany the landscape images are the kinds of sounds you might hear in those spaces, they're either a little too loud, or there's something that detaches them just a bit from the place we're seeing.
I've always been interested in that. I don't re-create reality, I create a metaphor that suggests reality. Within that metaphor I make things a little hyper-real, or surreal, just off balance.
In this film that approach seems especially appropriate. It's the separation between what Gein and Protti did and who they were perceived to be that's so creepy. Also, they don't remember doing these things, so they're disconnected from themselves.
How much did
cost?
About sixteen thousand dollars. That's just material costs. I do all the camerawork, the editingall those types of thingsand I don't pay myself a salary. My actors work almost for free.
Is the computer piece,
[1985], an homage to Hollis Frampton and
There's a general reference to Hollis because of his interest in computers and because I've always admired his work. And I liked him.
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Why did you focus on Pascal?
Well, he's an interesting person. He would work on a project and quickly get to the center of things, but then he'd get bored and go on to something else. He invented the first digital calculator; he almost discovered the calculus. He made contributions to fluid studies; he invented the syringe. Then he had this religious experience, dropped science, and started writing theoretical essays on religion. He became quite mad in the latter part of his life, obsessive about punishing himself for impious thoughts. He had a wall with spikes on it and every time he'd have an impious thought, he'd slam his fist into it!
Pascal was the starting point of that piece and provided the overall narrative structure. And then I added other things, about computers, about art, about how technology and art function together and apart. I like the piece. I want to do much more with computers.
Also, there's a computer language called Pascal.
Why didn't you use Pascal for the piece?
I should have. It's just that the NEC BASIC language is a little higher powered and so I could write fewer statements and get the same job done.
How much has
been shown?
I've shown it to a couple hundred people who have visited my loftfriends or people who call up and come over to see it. The only public screenings have been at the Kitchen and at the Museum School in Boston. Lots of people came to the Kitchen to see it.
I remember seeing Laurie Anderson there.
I just talked with her this past week. She had been going to my films at the Whitney retrospective. I think we have some similar ideas, especially about technology.
You've mentioned a new project [
] about a person who may or may not have killed somebody. What's the state of that project?
I've been doing research: basically, getting acquainted with Lawrencia Bembenek, who's been in prison for four years. I've visited her and written letters. I'm interested in how she feels about being in prison and in what she says happened when she was a police officer. And I'm very attracted to her.
