Dialogues

obstinately maintain, that the things only which can be touched or handled have being or essence, because they define being and body as one, and if anyone else says that what is not a body exists they altogether despise him, and will hear of nothing but body. Theaetetus I have often met with such men, and terrible fellows they are. Stranger And that is the reason why their opponents cautiously defend themselves from above, out of an unseen world, mightily contending that true essence consists of certain intelligible and incorporeal ideas; the bodies of the materialists, which by them are maintained to be the very truth, they break up into little bits by their arguments, and affirm them to be, not essence, but generation and motion. Between the two armies, Theaetetus, there is always an endless conflict raging concerning these matters. Theaetetus True. Stranger Let us ask each party in turn, to give an account of that which they call essence. Theaetetus How shall we get it out of them? Stranger With those who make being to consist in ideas, there will be less difficulty, for they are civil people enough; but there will be very great difficulty, or rather an absolute impossibility, in getting an opinion out of those who drag everything down to matter. Shall I tell you what we must do? Theaetetus What? Stranger Let us, if we can, really improve them; but if this is not possible, let us imagine them to be better than they are, and more willing to answer in accordance with the rules of argument, and then their opinion will be more worth having; for that which better men acknowledge has more weight than that which is acknowledged by inferior men. Moreover we are no respecters of persons, but seekers after truth. Theaetetus Very good. Stranger Then now, on the supposition that they are improved, let us ask them to state their views, and do you interpret them. Theaetetus Agreed. Stranger Let them say whether they would admit that there is such a thing as a mortal animal. Theaetetus Of course they would. Stranger And do they not acknowledge this to be a body having a soul? Theaetetus Certainly they do. Stranger Meaning to say that the soul is something which exists? Theaetetus True. Stranger And do they not say that one soul is just, and another unjust, and that one soul is wise, and another foolish? Theaetetus Certainly. Stranger And that the just and wise soul becomes just and wise by the possession of justice and wisdom,331 and the opposite under opposite circumstances? Theaetetus Yes, they do. Stranger But surely that which may be present or may be absent will be admitted by them to exist? Theaetetus Certainly. Stranger And, allowing that justice, wisdom, the other virtues, and their opposites exist, as well as a soul in which they inhere, do they affirm any of them to be visible and tangible, or are they all invisible? Theaetetus They would say that hardly any of them are visible. Stranger And would they say that they are corporeal? Theaetetus They would distinguish: the soul would be said by them to have a body; but as to the other qualities of justice, wisdom, and the like, about which you asked, they would not venture either to deny their existence, or to maintain that they were all corporeal. Stranger Verily, Theaetetus, I perceive a great improvement in them; the real aborigines, children of the dragon’s teeth, would have been deterred by no shame at all, but would have obstinately asserted that nothing is which they are not able to squeeze in their hands. Theaetetus That is pretty much their notion. Stranger Let us push the question; for if they will admit that any, even the smallest particle of being, is incorporeal, it is enough; they must then say what that nature is which is common to both the corporeal and incorporeal, and which they have in their mind’s eye when they say of both of them that they “are.” Perhaps they may be in a difficulty; and if this is the case, there is a possibility that they may accept a notion of ours respecting the nature of being, having nothing of their own to offer. Theaetetus What is the notion? Tell me, and we shall soon see. Stranger My notion would be, that anything which possesses any sort of power to affect another, or to be affected by another, if only for a single moment, however trifling the cause and however slight the effect, has real existence; and I hold that the definition of being is simply power. Theaetetus They accept your suggestion, having nothing better of their own to offer. Stranger Very good; perhaps we, as well as they, may one day change our minds; but, for the present, this may be regarded as the understanding which is established with them. Theaetetus Agreed. Stranger Let us now go to the friends of ideas; of their opinions, too, you shall be the interpreter. Theaetetus I will. Stranger To them we say⁠—You would distinguish essence from generation? Theaetetus “Yes,” they reply. Stranger And you would allow that we participate in generation with the body, and through perception, but we participate with the soul through thought in true essence; and essence you would affirm to be always the same and immutable, whereas generation or becoming varies? Theaetetus Yes; that is what we should affirm. Stranger Well, fair sirs, we say to them, what is this participation, which you assert of both? Do you agree with our recent definition? Theaetetus What definition? Stranger We said that being was an active or passive energy, arising out of a certain power which proceeds from elements meeting with one another. Perhaps your ears, Theaetetus, may fail to catch their answer, which I recognize because I have been accustomed to hear it. Theaetetus And what is their answer? Stranger They deny the truth of what we were just now saying to the aborigines about existence. Theaetetus What was that? Stranger Any power of doing or suffering in a degree however slight was held by us to be a sufficient definition of being? Theaetetus True. Stranger They deny this, and say that the power of doing or